[debsd]

More for information and interest.

Had the car serviced by BMW in July at 37k miles, asked for full diagnostic and return a fault with two glow plugs. After check with my indy in Elstree who looks after our 1998 E46 318 and 2000 Z3 (yes we have three Bimmers in our house hold:thumbsup) was advised to get BMW to do the job - bit the bullet and booked it in. On it's return, noticed a small oil leak on the drive. Retuned it to BMW thinking it may have something to do with the job undertaken, they inspected the car and gave it a clean bill of health.

Over the Christmas period notice the oil leak was getting worse so asked my indy to have a quick look - low and behold he told me it was pi$$ing oil all over the intercooler, starter-motor and into the undertray. Indy told me it looked like a big job. He called his contact at BMW explained the situ i.e. Full BMW service history, 44k miles recently serviced and just come out of workshop but importantly out of warranty :jaw-dropping. He was advised to give the BMW garage stick and push for goodwill not just because they missed the leak on a requested inspection, but a car of this condition age and mileage should not be showing this type of fault. BTW they didn't think the glow-plug work had any bearing on the leak but would have expected the technicians to have spotted it.

Yesterday took it back to BMW and let them have my displeasure. Today they called to confirm that it requires a new sump gasket and - this is the strange bit, they need to take the head off to pressure clean the pistons:eek. Estimated 12 hours labour!!!

I started to kick off but they immediately stated they would check with BMW HQ to see if they could undertake this under goodwill as they had checked the car specifically for leaks less than 6 weeks ago. I'm waiting to get an update tomorrow but thought I'd let open this up as a discussion as I've never heard of pressure cleaning the pistons - maybe the car has been burning oil?

 

[Ronnie]

I'm confused! taking the head off to pressure clean the pistons? :confused............:rofl

Any updates?

 

[debsd]

Had a hectic day yesterday. The dealership has offered 100% payment for the parts and 50% for the labour – or so I thought!!!

I couldn’t speak with the Service Manager so was dealing with his deputy as the SM was on leave – trust he has a great weekend. I had two issues, I don’t understand the problem which is effectively an oil leak that’s gonna cost over £2k to fix, and why this has happened to a 4 year old fully BMW serviced straight 6 with 44k miles????

I was advised to call BMW customer service who immediately opened a case, made no initial comment but said they call back once they had spoken to the dealership. On calling back they confirmed they would authorise the offer of 100% parts 50% labour. After pressing for clarity on the ‘authorisation’ bit it turn out that,
1) BMW UK will stump up the cost, not the dealership
2) The goodwill is based on the car being out of warranty but BMW not expecting this type of fault on a car of this condition (brand protection – fair play to them).
This in essence means the dealership will be paid 100% for repairing the car and as yet have not made any concession for the appalling service and inability to verify the leak when requested to inspect the car a few weeks ago. As I said I hope the service manager has a good weekend:hihi.

With regard to the fault itself I’m still unclear. Speaking to the Indy, he’s checked with his contacts at BMW and has told me the problem is likely to be either
1) a faulty turbo (not convinced). Apparently I’m being told that BMW changed these in 2005 as they were having problems with the previous – interested if anyone else has heard this?
2) a collapsed breather tube under the rocker cover that causes oil to get into the intercooler – need some clarity on this to make sure I got it right.
With regard to the pressure cleaning, this is still a mystery:confused, however I understand that BMW issue a notice called a PuMA Measure and this outlines recommended works for faults updates and fixes. It’s this document that is outlining the cleaning and sump gasket (which my Indy tell me he had never had the cause to change on a straight 6 will less than 100k miles on). The PuMA Measure has a reference number and I will seek to get this and google it if they don’t let me have a copy of the document itself.
Anyway it’s out and about in the wife’s Red Z3 this evening I’m afraid:cool as the 530d still in hospital – Can’t wait till Monday…..

 

[Ronnie]

This part here, number 15 resides in the cam cover(rocker cover for old types) http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=NC72&mospid=47753&btnr=11_3935&hg=11&fg=15, it's the OIL SEPARATOR and lives in the plastic housing #11(BREATHER), If the oil separator gets blocked it can cause turbo problems and it sounds like this is the direction it's heading in :eek

The turbos did have a problem and were changed, IIRC it was to do with the turbo impeller wheel.

See what more you can find out from the dealers as to your problem :thumbsup

 

[shaft69]

We having prblem with 6cyl diesels with oil leaks at mo, what it is excessive crankcase pressure. There is breather in rocker cover and dont have part of it fitted so having major leaks. Before had to fit modified breather to them from foam type as they were getting blocked and causing excessive smoke from exh. Now we to go back and fit foam type as modified type is also causing excessive crankcase pressure. some car req cyl head removed and steam cleaned and sump taking off to steam clean crank. Another major job on the 6cyl diesels.

 

[debsd]

Thanks Shaft69, can you explain why the cyliner head and crankshaft need cleaning?
I'm no mechnic but oil burning in the cylinder I can almost understand but thought this would just burn off unless excessive or happening for a long time, but steam cleaning the crankshaft after 44k miles????

 

[Ronnie]

So they started with the original style breathers,
View attachment 1686 View attachment 1687

then went to the modified type,
View attachment 1688

and back again! :eek

View attachment 1685

Problems galore :frown

 

[redadair]

Fookin ell. I'll be keeping a close eye for any oild puddles from now on as I have a 2005 530d E60

Sorry to hear of your troubles debsd but thanks very much for sharing such an informative read!

Is it possible that after an official dealer oil service I would have had the foam thing fitted and / or checked or that is not covered by the service? red

 

[Ronnie]

Fookin ell. I'll be keeping a close eye for any oild puddles from now on as I have a 2005 530d E60

Sorry to hear of your troubles debsd but thanks very much for sharing such an informative read!

Is it possible that after an official dealer oil service I would have had the foam thing fitted and / or checked or that is not covered by the service? red

Should be detailed on your service sheet :thumbsup

 

[debsd]

I;ve heard that this should be checked / replaced on the 3rd oil service. Once I've had the official fault diagnosis, If it is down to this little sucker (or should that be breather ;-)). i will insist that BMW go back through the service schedules and check to see if they were if in fact changed.

Will let you know

 

[Ronnie]

Good work Debsd :thumbsup

 

[gazz c]

great,i just changed my breather for modified ,does that meen i should change it back,am i going to get problems,anyone know

 

[Ronnie]

great,i just changed my breather for modified ,does that meen i should change it back,am i going to get problems,anyone know

I would think as long as the breather is kept clean it will be OK, I would recommend checking it every 12000 miles or so, sooner if it's a big worry

 

[shaft69]

Alot of 6ctl dont have any at all so causes excess pressure and oil leaks. Be ok with mod type.

 

[debsd]

Spoke with Service manager and it turns out the fault is down to a blocked breather.......
He's also informed me that they are changed on the 3rd oil service and that they are replaced with a modified one. Not sure if this is the one's referred to in previous posts.
No movement from the dealership on their contribution however armed with this information I've been back to BMW Cust Services to see if I can get anywhere with them. I've complained that they know the original part is defective (hence they replaced the part type) and the only reason they didn't change it on my car in July when they last serviced it, was due to it doing too few miles - not due for it third oil service. So, I'm currently facing a £1000 contribution to cleaning up a mess they could have prevented. Or had I exceeded the mileage for the third service before my car went out of warranty, they would have changed the breather. Either way they want to play it, it sucks and BMW should warn / advise it customers of this situation. Apparently it would have cost around £150 to change outside of the service. I'm sure I would not be alone in taking this up if they advised me of the impending doom if I didn't. Awaiting BMW Cust Service to get back to me.

 

[Ronnie]

Great update debsd but pity it wasn't tinted with great news, I will have my fingers crossed for you though when customer services ring back

 

[debsd]

BMW had responded and due the circumstances of the breather causing the damage, which would have been changed on my next service, they have revised their offer to cover all the labour, leaving me to pick up the bill for the parts. The dealership are currently working this out but pretty sure it'll be less than the £1000 labour contribtion for the first offer. Will let you know.

 

[redadair]

Great news BMW are finally coming round to owning up, good arguement on your behalf too!

You've got me worried now, I have had the 3rd dealer service now (2 from previous owner) and there is no mention of a breather bit being replaced. Wouldn't know what one was if it came and hit me on the head either!

 

[MTec B]

All this reading about swirl flaps (I know it is on a different thread) oil leaks, breather blockages, more oil leaks, 2k to fix, engines going bang is making me very nervous, in fact my back end is beginning to twitch!!!! Man I am with Red on this one!!!

 

[Ronnie]

You should both look into getting the breather changed if it hasn't been done and you have high mileage :thumbsup

Preventative measure, otherwise it "could" end up like this :hihi http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=M-pxsViKF88&NR=1 :rofl

Turbo seals go on inlet side, oil goes into inlet manifold/cylinders, engine burns it and runs away, you turn off engine and it keeps going as it's feeding itself on oil :rofl

then it eventually runs out of oil and stops or goes bang :hihi............:frown

But that REALLY IS WORSE CASE scenario :lol

Trusty Diesel lumps