BMW INPA E36 OBD OBD2 and ADS interfaces explained - Page 7

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    #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by dailydoggy View Post
    seems to me joylove is explaining it fine and correct, but you chaps are making your quest to talk to your car way more complicated and confusing than you have to...

    Actually all I needed was someone to say yes to this line.....

    Quote Originally Posted by E36Coupe328 View Post
    That or we are using a fully OBD2 device, but just using INPA to access the K line and the rest of the interfaces capabilities are of no interest to us?

    .............a couple of posts ago


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    #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by E36Coupe328 View Post
    We'vegot our wires crossed (not literally)

    I have a 1994 325 and a 1995 328.

    I an not interested in ODB2, I want the cheapest way of speaking to the DME. I've got a KKL VAGCOM cable with 9 port serial connector on the way and the 20 pin adapter already.
    I think you'll need the £55 ADS interface for these older DMEs. I don't have access to these pre-facelift cars to check if they are 1-wire enabled.
    Quote Originally Posted by E36Coupe328 View Post
    Actually all I needed was someone to say yes to this line.....

    That or we are using a fully OBD2 device, but just using INPA to access the K line and the rest of the interfaces capabilities are of no interest to us?

    .............a couple of posts ago
    Unfortunately a yes/no answer was not possible. This is becuase the VAGCOM cable is not a full OBD2 device. It contains no software for forming and decoding OBD2 messages.

    This would be a an example of fully OBD2 device.

    You see the difference I hope between this handheld device and a USB-OBD2 lead?

    I agreed with the second half of the quote (after the comma), it is quite correct.
     
     

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    #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by linux44 View Post
    Hi mate,
    Thank you for ur response, can u explain a bit more about "12V idle/0V active" what is it? i have seen this written in many places.
    It defines a logic 0 as 12V and logic 1 as 0V

    Quote Originally Posted by linux44 View Post
    2ndly, is BMW talking in DS2 or OBD2 then ?
    Both are available. INPA speaks DS2. There is also on your E46 an iBus, M-bus (for the HVAC motors) and CANBUS but they are on the diagnostic port
    Quote Originally Posted by linux44 View Post
    I know for fact that E46 can speak OBD as I connect my normal ELM interface to it but not my e36 which i think has some older protocol.
    Correct, DS2 and OBD2 are available on your E46 diagnostic port. On your pre 2000 EU E36 port the OBD2 wires aren't in the vehicle harness.
    Quote Originally Posted by linux44 View Post
    I also have heard BMW from 2007 or higher has gone to new ds2 version which speaks in 100k buad rate, is that correct?
    Yes that is correct, K-CAN. It is conceivable it can be underclocked to 9600 baud for compatibility mode, if it has auto baud rate detection, I don't have a car to test this on, but NealP does.

    Quote Originally Posted by linux44 View Post
    One thing i appreciate if u could clarify,
    what is the difference between,
    Chipset such as ELM
    Protocol such as OBD
    and standard such as 9141

    and do u know the chipset for BMW e36?

    i asked quite few question but hope u don't mind
    I'm not sure what an ELM does. I suspect it's a K line transceiver and RS232 interface.

    OBD if you mean OBD1 is entirely propriety to the vehicle manufacturer. In the case of BMW, the language is DS2, the interface is 2 wire 9600 baud moving to 1wire 9600/10400 baud moving to 1 wire 100k baud.

    9141 is a messaging structure standard that all OBD2 vehicles can support, 1 wire 9600 baud, standardised message structures (start/stop/parity/checksum) and error packet handling (retransmission/acknowledges).

    Chipset for E36? pre facelift - ADS. Post facelift - mixed ADS/K line. Messaging standard DS2.
     
     

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    #64
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    Hi,

    Thanks for putting together a comprehensive post on this.

    However, my analogue brain is still trying to process all the info and requested whether I could just ask to simplify matters.

    I have an E36 1998 323i Coupe Automatic.
    I have a VAGCOM USB interface and recently bought a Chinese C@rsoft 5.6 serial interface module.

    I tried the VAGCOM USB interface with my engine side 20 pin socket and didn't get very far - it seemed to connect but didn't seem to read anything. I found some info about shorting pins on this interface to get it to work but then also there are posts stating doing this it still doesn't work on the 323.

    I tried the serial interface with supplied software and it connected ok, gave me live readings rpm, o2, maf etc.. But when I tried to read all the modules it read some but not all.

    The 2 immediate things I want to achieve are;
    1. Read my ASC module - it is currently disabled and I want to get it working again.
    2. Clear my brake pad wear indicator - when I bought the car I was told the brake pads/disks had been replaced but the light was on. I checked them and indeed they were new but the front NS sensor had been 'activated' and not replaced. I replaced the sensor but the warning light is still on even after trying various suggestions of pressing the brake pedal with the drivers door open and turning on the ignition. None have made it go off.

    Then I would like to get another ignition key and program it in to the car (EWS II?).

    I note the reference to ADS interface for 'older' cars - BUT is my car a compatible 'older' car and ideally since I already have 2 interfaces I would like to avoid buying another and achieve my goals with cleverer software or mods to my interfaces.

    Thanks,

    Mark
     
     

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    #65
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    Shorting pins 7&8 is for cars without the 20 pin connector.
    The ABS module is old and needs £85 ADS interface over factory fitted RS232.
    Brake wear indicator is done by a sensor that is GNDed when pads are worn. No ECU involvement.
    EWS coding can't help with, I don't know if it is possible with INPA, you may need NCS, which I can't help with.
     
     

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    #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by joylove View Post
    Shorting pins 7&8 is for cars without the 20 pin connector.
    The ABS module is old and needs £85 ADS interface over factory fitted RS232.
    Brake wear indicator is done by a sensor that is GNDed when pads are worn. No ECU involvement.
    EWS coding can't help with, I don't know if it is possible with INPA, you may need NCS, which I can't help with.
    Thanks for your reply.

    So there isn't a single interface which does everything...
     
     

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    #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markie76 View Post
    Thanks for your reply.

    So there isn't a single interface which does everything...
    The ADS interface will "do" both the 'old gen' and 'new gen' modules that are mixed into your post 1996 car.
     
     

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    #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by joylove View Post
    The ADS interface will "do" both the 'old gen' and 'new gen' modules that are mixed into your post 1996 car.
    Brilliant thx - I'll add it to my xmas list
     
     

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    #69
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    I'm back - I have been doing further research and need further advice....

    I read somewhere about about different models not having all the pins present in their 20 pin socket in the engine bay. So I decided to have a look at mine and I have the following 9 pins;

    1
    7
    12
    14
    15
    16
    18
    19
    20


    I also got out out my 'BMW Interface' and it has status leds for;
    K-Line Pin 20,
    K-Line Pin 17 &
    L-Line Pin 15
    as below;




    So is this already an ADS & OBD interface?
    I suppose I'm not getting access to all the modules as I do not have a Pin 17?

    So what are my options?
     
     

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    #70
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    17 is TxD2, and only for DME and EGS. There are also on 15 and 20. You must use a factory fitted serial port and STD:ADS to access your old gen modules.
     
     

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