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1995 E36 m3 immobiliser/ews problem

33K views 72 replies 8 participants last post by  19-bad 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
hi guys, i have a '95 3.0 m3 with a std bmw alarm(3g) mk1 and ews

over winter the battery died, i dont know how long for as i dont use the car in winter.
when i charged it back up the car had forgotten the alarm remote.
i could lock/unlock the doors with the key but not the alarm remote.
after a bit of meessing about, with the key and buttons, i got the remote working again.
now the alarm works as it should, but i cant get the car to start
it was all working fine when i parked it up.
when i turn the key i get ign lights, but then turn to crank and nothing happens.

i can hear any relays clicking, no starter, cant hear the fuel pump priming but not sure if i should?
theres a permanent live at the starter but no signal when cranking.
does this sound like a ews/immobilser fault?

nothing i do will make the car start.
any ideas on how to get the car going again?
cheers
 
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#2 ·
Are you 100% sure the battery is OK? If it has failed you'll still get the lights but nothing else and clicking from the relays.

Assuming you've tried a replacement battery or a jump start then read on....

Sounds like you have read this....

[URL]http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f3/e36-alarm-identification-guide-3t-2t-3g-ews-t39173/[/URL]

As you have been fiddling (with the best of intentions) there could be some confusion with the EWS system. Firstly check the bootlid wiring as per the guide. This often shorts the CL system. Next make sure the alarm is unset and try locking & unlocking the car with the key, then try to start it (this will send the unset signal to EWS). Lastly try another key if you have one.
 
#3 ·
thanks for the reply,
yes i have read that thread, it helped me know what i have lol

the battery on the car is fine, fairly new, fully charged and ive also tried it with the charger connected and set to boost(basically jump started while plugged into the mains)
there is no clicking of relays/starter like a flat battery would give. theres no live to the starter when the car is cranked.

i have tried starting the car after using the alarm and key in both doors, still nothing.

unfortunately i dont have a spare key or alarm fob
bootlid wiring is fine, its like new under there.
it seems more of an immobiliser prob than an alarm prob.
where is the starter relay?

i also tried to disconect the battery, wait 5 mins, turned key to p2 then reconect the battery
still nothing
 
#5 ·
all fuses are ok, tried a different relay for the dme, pulled the boot wiring rubber off (no damaged wires),
the car has been outside all winter and theres hardly any trees, u thinking wet dme? i took the cover off the compartment and theres no evidence of it being wet, but i could take it out and open it up if its worth a look?
 
#8 ·
If the compartment is dry then it's unlikely there will have been an issue.

Your car is a 1995, was it built in 1995 or late 1994? - If manufactured before Jan 95 it will have EWS I and there is a starter immobilisation relay instead of the chip/transponder system that EWS II uses. All the info I have seen is from the USA which states the relay is "In the relay carrier to the left of the steering column" which I take to mean behind the glovebox on UK cars.

If it is post Jan 1995 and you have EWS II it may be time to order a second key and try that. Keys can lose their coding and it is not unknown for previously "broken" keys to start working once a newly coded key has been used. Worst case you'll have a spare key!

After that then unless there is a failure of the EWS module (which is coded to the DME for EWS II) then it suspect it may not be an immobiliser problem after all!
 
#10 ·
No way of self-diagnosing that I'm aware of.

I've read that once the new key has been used old keys can "magically" comes back to life, I guess they just start recognising previously coded keys once EWS is kicked back into life!

You could probably get the key recoded at the dealer but I doubt you'll pay less than an hours labour and at the end you'll still have one key. New keys are around £30 to £40 and come cut & coded.

I'd still give some thought to a dodgy connection / earth somewhere.

You could always try something like putting the key in the ignition, switching to position 2 and disconnecting & reconnecting the battery - it may jump EWS back into life! Or try the key in upside down, or give it a wiggle when you try & start the car

Sorry, I'm clutching at straws here as there is only so much you can do over the web.
 
#11 ·
No worries mate, im kinda clutchin at straws anyway thats y i posted.
I guess ill get a new key and go from there.
Just didnt wanna buy 1 to find its not that. Still like u say ill end up with a spare, i might aswell get a new alarm remote while im at it. Ive had the car 8yrs with only 1 key lol.
Thanks for trying, ill let u know how i get on.
 
#12 ·
Just had a similar problem on a '96 518, though intermittenti. I tried all sorts to fix it with no luck.

Last ditch attempt was to change 2 fuses that looked perfectly OK, and hey presto, problem solved. All I can think is that they had condensation in the fuses. If yours has been stood outside over winter, it might be worth changing fuses even if they look OK just to see what happens.

One other thought. If the alarm is the serpi star 3g, then this would have been installed post build and the wiriong for the alarm will have been spliced into the loom at the power distribution box under the back seat. The wires should have been soldered and taped. Might be worth checking those splices are still OK.
 
#13 ·
One other thought. If the alarm is the serpi star 3g, then this would have been installed post build and the wiriong for the alarm will have been spliced into the loom at the power distribution box under the back seat. The wires should have been soldered and taped. Might be worth checking those splices are still OK.
Have you read my guide Richard?

[url]http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f3/e36-alarm-identification-guide-3t-2t-3g-ews-t39173/[/URL]

The alarm module is behind the dash on the E36, Under the rear seat on the E34.
 
#14 ·
i had a play with the car again last night.

i found the ews box and checked i had power at it from the fuse, which i do, and the earth is ok.
when i turn the key to p3(cranking to start) i get a live into the ews box from the key, but no live out to the starter or to the dme.
also i dont get any sort of signal from the reciever.
does this sound like the key is at fault?
the dme fuse is ok, and when i turn the ign on i get a very faint buzzing in the engein bay area, if i unplug the ecu or the relay the buzzing stopps, so its obviously doing something. but theres no signal from the ews to tell it to power up properly.

i think its the key but just want some1 more in the know to say what they think.

cheers
 
#16 ·
billy, ive just been messing about again lol

ive taken an ews unit out of another car, (my dads, another e36, 3.0 m3 95 with the same alarm) the ews box had the same part number on it, i tried that in my car with my key, didnt work,
tried his ews and his key held next to mine (mine in the barrel to turn, his next to it for the chip to be read) didnt work,
then tried his transponder ring from around his ign key, his ews bux, but my key in the barrel again, still didnt work.

do i need to take any other bits off his car for his chip to run my car?
such as the little black box (transmitter module) the transponder ring plugs into?

or any other way you can think of fault finding my car with his spare parts?
cheers
 
#18 ·
ill swap the dme with it if it will help eliminate what could be causing the problem.

if i take the ews and dme out of my dads car and plug them in mine should it fire up then?
what about the key?
will i need my key in the barrel but his key next to the transponder ring for the chip?
 
#22 ·
Good luck with the DME swap. It's worth a try. If you're getting +12v to the EWS from the ignition switch (black/yellow or green/black wire I think) but not on the output to the starter (black yellow wire?) it does sound EWS or Key related.
As far as I'm aware, with EWS2 the EWS unit would enable the starter as long as the key was recognised, and allow the car to crank. It just wouldn't enable the coils and injectors unless the code sent to the DME were then verified as ok.

When my DME on a 95 model was knackered by water and was operating the injectors just with the ignition switched on, the starter still cranked over.
 
#23 ·
i will try swapping dme's but i dont think that is where the code is held.
the reason for this is last year i swapped ecus with a mate of mine for a bit to try and diagnose a fault that could have been ecu related (coil breaking down)
i fitted his ecu to my car without doing anything else and it started and ran as normal off my key/ews/alarm.....

so if it worked with my ews and his ecu then it should work now with my ecu but a different ews, the code must be held elsewhere? as in the little transmitter i was on about?
 
#24 ·
If you want to swap parts, you need to swap the DME, EWS box, and chip - Make sure yours is removed from the key, as the induction ring will more likely pick the code up off your key !

Another thing to try, is lock the car (double lock it, make sure the petrol flap locks), but leave the window down... Once locked, turn the ignition on. IF the car unlocks, then the code HAS been recognized by the EWS box (As a correctly recognized code by the EWS sends an unlock signal to the ZKE). If the car doesn't unlock, then chances are, the code has been 'lost' off the key !
 
#25 ·
Thats helpful, by double lock do u mean lock, unlock, lock again? Or lock, lock then ign? If i lock it twice nothing mechanical happens on the 2nd lock, it doesnt dead lock.

I have the induction ring off my dads car plugged in and lying on the floor so it doesnt pick up my key.

Im not sayin u guys are wrong but y would my car run when i fitted my mates ecu but not his key/ews?
 
#26 ·
Ahhh, so the induction ring can't pickup your key - Thats good.

When I say double lock, I mean use the key in the door, and just lock it as normal (No turning to lock then unlock again like Fords), you can confirm it's double locked if the petrol flap has locked, or try reaching for the interior handle, and pull it.
Don't just lock using the pin on the door, as that doesn't double lock. Don't use the alarm either, as it'll go off when you try the ignition, and it will more than likely try to close the windows too.

What year is your mates M3 ?
 
#27 ·
Yea induction ring on the floor with the key from that car in it.
My dads car that im takin the bits off now is a 95 car,
My mates car whos dme i fitted ages ago is a 95 car, mine is 95 to, so all the same year.

Ill try refittin all my bits tonight and see if it unlocks, then put my dads bits on it after.

Stupid thing is it was fine when i parked it up.

If it is the key can it be reprogrammed to work again?
 
#31 ·
right i tried double lock, but it didnt do anything.
lock with the key once, the dors lock, lock again, nothing happens, petrol flap doesnt seem to be able to lock,
if i pull the interior handle it just unlocks the doors, turn the ign on, and it doesnt unlock,

if i turn and hold the key in the lock the window starts to go up.


i tried starting it with all the parts off my dads one, (dme, ews, transmittor/reciever, induction ring, key in the induction ring while laying on the floor, but my key in the barrel) and i still got ign lights but nothing more.

im all out of ideas now.
any1?
 
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