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How smooth are your gearboxes?

4K views 41 replies 21 participants last post by  sprintman 
#1 ·
Hi,

I've got a '97 z3 2.8l with 120k miles, and it's great. I changed the gearbox oil a while ago and it made it a hell of a lot smoother.

Now then, my girlfriend's just bought a '95 VW corrado 2.9l vr6 storm with 115k miles, and it's absolutely gorgeous. Apparently they only made 500 storms! Dark green (almost black) with full cream leather. Very quick and the sound of that vr6 is pure sex. “Too fast for a girl”, I tell her ha ha! I say she can get away with it though coz it's only a pussy FWD so it's not a proper sports car. This causes lots of the “you drive a hairdresser’s car” comments, to which I reply “yeah but you can only do doughnuts in reverse”, etc etc. All good fun.

Anyway, I had a go in it last night and the gearbox is SO light, ridiculously light. Like if you just sneeze in the general direction of the gearstick it’ll slip into first. Fart hard and you’re into second. Anyway, yeah, ridiculously smooth. When I say I couldn’t believe it, I mean it literally.

Now before my Z I’ve only had Peugeots, and they have some of the worst gearboxes on the planet. I heard they make their synchros out of camembert, and use garlic bulbs for the bearings. Because of this I don’t have much to compare with mine. I do get to drive a lot of different cars through my job, but they’re all brand new or nearly new, so that doesn’t count. Basically what it comes down to is the only comparison I have for my gearbox is my gf’s new corrado.

When driving my Z the gearbox isn’t a problem, but comparing it to that corrado it’s absolutely awful. Mine will sometimes not go into first very easy, so I just come off the clutch in neutral to spin the box up, then clutch down again and it goes straight in. There’s always a bit of resistance though, I can feel the synchros making contact before it’ll actually slip into gear. It does this between every gear, and it’s especially noticeable going third to fourth. In that corrado you can’t feel a thing, every gear change you can use your baby finger. Even slipping into first gear while you’re moving at speed, say about 15-20mph, it still just slides straight in. I’d have to whack mine in pretty hard if I wanted to go into first while I was moving at that kinda speed, and to be honest it’s something I avoid doing.

So then, what are your gearboxes like? Can you feel a slight resistance between each gear as the synchros make contact? Does it ever not want to go into first gear?

People with cars that are less than, say, 6 or 7 years old need not reply. Also, people with less than about 60-70k miles, you don’t really count either. It’s the older, higher mileage cars I’m interested in.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with my gearbox, I just wonder how it compares to other BMW’s of similar age/mileage, seeing as though that corrado’s box is in another league completely.

Cheers for reading,
Leon
 
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#2 ·
I've got a 94 325i with 110k and the gearbox feel fine, it's had new gearbox oil too. I would say that it feels precise, you know when you're changing gear that something mechanical is happening.
Cars where it's just soooo easy to change gear are nice but I think they can feel too easy sometimes.

I've had my share of older cars and driven plenty and it's just a case of them all being different. If it's a boring saloon car that you don't feel the need to drive fast in, the gear change is generally easy/smooth/effortless. If it's something a bit sporty then it might be a bit more mechanical feeling. There are exceptions to this rule though lol
 
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#5 ·
Yeah I know what you mean, and I agree. My mate used to have a mk1 mr2, old school, and that thing was proper notchy. I only had a go in it once though, years ago. Just driving that rado last night really took me by surprise how light the gearstick felt. Almost too light.
 
#7 ·
Mine is smooth enough, can feel its quite mechanical and precise put that down to it having quite a short shift. It don't like going into first at any great speed but that's acceptable as the synromeshes would be working over time to do it.
Maybe it the fact its FWD there will be longer gear linkages, giving more leverage/taking some of the mechanical feeling away?

(160000 miles on mine)
 
#9 ·
Depends what gearbox your car has in it.

My manual e39 had a ZF box in it, which at 60k miles was chattering in idle. BMW fitted a new gearbox and clutch, then at 110k miles the chattering starts coming back. Speaking to a gearbox specialist it's very common on certain ZF boxes.

The gearchanges were also notchy on both the old and new boxes.

However, on older e36's the gearchanges were lovely. Same on a newer e46 325 I had, and a 2001 e46 320 we still have, all fine.
 
#11 ·
Yeah mine’s got the ZF box, 5 speed. I think it’s the S5-31. Maybe it’s just supposed to be pretty lumpy.

I can really feel a thud when going third to fourth though, particularly if I’m driving “spiritedly”. If I hold the gearstick on the “resistance” going into fourth for a split second though, it slides straight in. In my head this means that synchro is taking a while to match the speeds, so if I just slam the gearstick across there’s a bit of hard dog-on-dog contact, but if I press the synchros together and wait a second the speeds match and the dogs mate together perfectly. That’s what started this thread, I was wondering if my gearbox is PARTICULARLY notchy, or whether it’s just normal.

Cheers,
Leon
 
#13 ·
If you think your gearboxes are bad try a E90 one then, reverse is a pig to get into, and it's notchy as hell in almost every gear, it's like they added the 6th gear as an afterthought.

James may does a program called Big Ideas where he does lots of wierd stuff, one episode is called "come fly with me" and he drives a car that can also fly, it seems to have a gearbox straight out of the E90, anyone who has seen the episode will know what i mean :)

For those who have not seen it YouTube - James May Big Ideas You Tube

Forward to 1:20
 
#17 ·
Sorry mate the Z3 just wasn't for me.

I was in the market for a BMW soft top a few years ago and couldn't decide whether to go for a late model low mileage 2.8 or 3.0 Z3 or up the budget and go for an early 3.0 litre Z4. I found that despite having the same engine as the late model 3.0 litre Z3, the early 3.0 litre Z4 looked, felt and drove much better. Looks I realise are a personal taste thing but the car genuinely felt better. i.e. better put together, better equipped and better laid out in terms of the dash etc.

Anyway, that gets away from the original point of your thread and the Z4 I ultimately bought was an auto anyway so also irrelevant to the topic.

On a serious note though, the Corrado is an excellent sports car. I owned three in succession (16V, G60 and VR6) in the early to mid 90's. I reckon if VW still made them I'd still be buying them.
 
#18 ·
First I thought your slave cylinder might have needed looking at but with the thud you describe (like the m3 episode on wheeler dealers) it sounds like your box is knackered. However hard they are it shouldn't thud when changing gears.

mines nearly touching 120k and box is running fine, new clutch at 113k but didn't change the oil :thumbsup
 
#20 ·
Ha ha yeah no worries mate, I was only messing. All good fun. Yeah each to their own, couldn't agree more.

To be honest if I had the money I'd certainly have a Z4. They were just outside my budget when I was buying. I was looking at the S2000 too, but again just a tad too expensive for a decent one.

I totally agree about the rado though, it's gorgeous. One thing I'm particuarly jealous of is the sound of that VR6. "VR-sex", as she calls it ha ha. It really is an awesome car. I think most of the appeal comes from the rarity, especially with it being a storm. The only negative I can find with it is the front wheel drive. It's just no fun in comparison. Great in a straight line, but I put my foot down coming out of a corner in second and it just, well, huge understeer!

I don't see the point in having that much power to the front wheels. It's like the new ford focus rs. 300hp. 300! And about four-hundred-and-something newton metres of torque! To the front wheels? Excuse me? I can just imagine that being absolutely no fun whatsoever. I don't care what kind of trick diff they put on it, and I absolutely don't believe anything they say on top gear, that car will be impossible to drive fast, and no fun at all.

Maybe I'm biased now I've owned a RWD, but I certainly will never buy a performance car that isn't either RWD or 4WD. I'd rather have an old beat up mx-5 than a brand new civic type-r.

Gone off topic a bit, but I don't care, I started it ha ha

Cheers,
Leon
 
#21 ·
I've had 3 Bmws a 328 e36 with 75k on clock, 318ti e36 with 114k and currently a 316 e46 on 140k and all have had the notchy gearbox effect. Especially the difficulty going into 1st. I think alot of it is because the gearbox location?
You don't hear alot of horror stories about BMW gearboxes tbh.
A friend of mine has a 2004 320d on 55k, has replaced clutch and flywheel, but his gearbox feels just like mine
 
#25 ·
2001 E46 330 Ci 123k miles - manual gearbox is very notchy - regularly have to double de-clutch to get 1st from standstill, has kicked out of second twice (probably my fault tbh not getting all the way in before coming off the clutch). Regularly goes to 5th instead of 3rd (both up from 2nd & down from 4th) when cold. Spring doesn't return to centre neutral spot - seems to push stick towards 5th side of gate. Been reading lots of stuff on here about detent pins/bearings etc & thinking that might be what I need (it had new clutch & flywheel in sept last year, so I know that should be ok). I'll change the oil at some point & see if it improves - might be worth OP doing that too, just as a comparison?
 
#27 ·
Cheers mate, already changed the oil. Made a huge difference. To be honest I didn't really realise anything untoward until I drove my gf's corrado last night. Maybe that's just what these gearboxes are supposed to be like. So many people have replied saying theirs is notchy too, I feel a lot better.

Has anyone got a story of a gearbox in a BMW that they've wrecked? Santa pod doesn't count by the way. Just wondering how tough these things actually are, because I do like to drive it properly.

Cheers,
Leon
 
#29 ·
Nothing wrong with Castrol dextron 3...that's what's in mine :D
I think you'd notice a difference between olive oil and redline for example, but not between two similarly respectable oils and I doubt it will cure any problems you're having tbh.
 
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#32 ·
The VR6 Corrado is probably the best handling FWD drive car ever produced. Ive had 2 of them and can confidently say they would hand most BMWs there arse on a plate round a twisty road! So proper sports car it certainly is!
They have the cable change 02A box and actually many owners dont like this as when the cables stretch they can be a bit of a swine to engage gears. The Mk1 and 2 Golfs have the 020 box and they are rod change as apposed to cables. They are nothcy but on the Mk3 they fitted a weighted shift rod that got rid of all of that and this same rod can be fitted to both the first two cars

In my opinion the box on both my BMW, the vert and the coupe, is pretty cack, durable yes but not particulary nice to change gear with!. The throw between gears
feels like its a couple of feet between each. I also find that you have to push down pretty damn hard to get them into reverse.
 
#33 ·
God I hope she never reads this ha ha. She'd love you. In all seriousness though I know it's an awesome car, I just say that stuff to wind her up. Lots of banter in our house, it's very good for your health.

Personally though I doubt I’ll ever buy a FWD car again, at least not one I intend to have any fun in. The thought of not being able to step the back end out completely ruins it for me. I know it sounds childish, maybe I am.

Interesting stuff there on the vw boxes. You sound like someone who knows what they're on about. Isn't the 02A the one where the diff is riveted to the final drive crown wheel and they're prone to shearing off? My mate had a seat leon a while ago, this happened to him. I helped him get it out and back in again (didn't attempt to open it up though), and I'm sure it was an "02A" box. VW deny there's a fault yet conveniently sell repair kits, which basically consist of 8 bolts at the generous price of about £50! The idea is you punch all the remaining rivets out and replace them with these bolts, also repairing any damage they caused flying around in there.

Luckily for him the only damage was a small hole in the bell housing which needed welding up, but I remember reading cases where the sheared-off rivet had made a right mess. Even still, it cost him about £200 in labour to have the box stripped down and rebuilt (plus a bit of welding).

God I hope this isn't the same box.

Cheers,
Leon
 
#34 ·
you've confirmed you've checked the bushes and flex coupling - so if they're fine then the only options to improve things further is to replace the CDV (i.e. Earls stainless braided hose) and I'd also recommend replacing the gearbox and diff fluid. When I did my fluid changes for the gearbox and diff I went for:

Gearbox: Amsoil Synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid
Diff: Castrol SAF-XJ 75w-140

and noticed a good improvement! - well worth doing IMHO
 
#35 ·
escort mk1, gearchange was like a rifle bolt, only manuel that came close for me a 2.8 capri box and a rover v8s, never driven a corrado but a mate has work has a seat and all the controls on that are way way way too light, a friggin womens car, and the 2 family golf gti's gearchange was nought special either, as good a car as they were, both mk2's, but nothing ive driven has come close to the 1300 1975 escort that was my first car
 
#38 ·
Thats what my old man used, mark 2, when he went on his own when he was a driving intsructor. Then the mark 3 came out and he got that but went back to a mark 2 saying the gearbox, clutch and steering in the mark 2 was better.

The gearbox is good in the e34 but not TOO light and you know youve actually changed gear:rofl

Will do the oil in next couple weeks when weathers a bit better tho.
 
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